BootsnAll Travel Community

So I'm into amatuer photography, but I'm looking for some critique of my work before I look into possibly earning a little money on the side.

So, what would be the best way to do this? I have a flickr account, but I'm not sure if my work is "good enough".

Do you participate in any of the groups that are on flickr..the ones where people give some critique and tips. That helps to hear from others.

I cannot critque much...since I'm a total novice myself. Its like correcting english for me..i know something is wrong i just don't know the rules or grammar. Same way with Photography.

My suggestion would be to add some groups to your flickr acct.

I know this isn't what you asked, but be careful about where you take criticism from. If you ask random strangers for opinions, they will tear your work apart for all the wrong reasons. A group of five internet people will always find flaws in your work, and often their feedback will not be conducive to your becoming a better photographer.

Figure out how you plan to make money from your photos, and then try to find other people in the same market who can give you feedback. One thing I've learned about critiquing is that you need to be specific in what you're looking for, or you'll just end up with a lot of nitpicky crap that doesn't help you at all.

My suggestions:

1. Find real people by taking a course or joining a group. I think it's important to develop a relationship of trust and understanding in what you're all trying to accomplish in order to get valid feedback.

2. Find a photographer (one who actually makes money) and harass them for their advice. This is probably difficult, but if option 1 isn't really possible, then what have you got to lose here? Be specific in what you're looking for. This photographer should be working in the area you're interested in. Hobby photographers are full of opinions but know nothing about the realities of submission requirements, marketing, etc.

3. Madhu's suggestion is a really good alternative to the above, just keep in mind my initial warning about random criticisms!

This is a great shot:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/flip_flop_princess/2304044744/

It looks like you have a good instinct for colour and composition so just make sure you're solid on the technical aspects of what you're doing. If you're comfortable there, then just start submitting away. Rejection is good. I don't know what the photographic world is like, but you may even get notes from editors along the lines of "Great shot, but I'd like to see more of..."

My brother is a (working) professional photographer. If you're absolutely desperate for feedback then I can sweet talk him into giving some on a couple of images. It'll be raw, technical, and possibly harsh though, so I'd only go that route if you're really stuck


Edit: A couple of additional notes.

Post processing skills (read: photoshop) are important.
For valid critique, you'll need to provide much larger photos than are available on your flickr account right now.
Watch those crooked horizon lines!

Some pros on Flickr complain that their photos are used without permission, so I'd be careful about sticking up high resolution shots. Obviously make sure that the copyright is enabled (all my stuff is CC, and I'm careful to check if I want to use other people's pictures on my blog (with attribution), but not everyone plays nice).

I think there are dedicated groups/sites for pros to showcase and critique their work, but I find that Flickr has the best userbase. Have a look through the groups. Here are a few to get you started (but bear in mind what markus said!):

http://www.flickr.com/groups/photography/

http://www.flickr.com/groups/photocritiqueforum/

There are dozens more

Oh, I forgot about photo.net

A little more pro oriented than flickr. I haven't used it in quite some time though. Philip Greenspun has posted several good tutorials: http://photo.net/learn/

Ok, I agree, you need to be careful who you get critiqued from. I just looked at all your photos and I think you have a great eye. (I have a BFA in photo and worked as a professional photographer for many, many years, although i am only shooting for myself and occasionally for a friends event if they ask me to, etc).

I would say one of the first things you need to do is create another flicker, picasa, photo.net, etc account. You can have one acct for your personal pics and your memories that you love looking at but aren't professional material. Then on your pro site you really have to narrow down w/ a harsh eye which ones really work. This can be hard but it's necessary. eventually you're going to show this to people who might hire you and you want them to see the best of the best.

I also noticed that you def. have a style and i think some of your landscapes are really fantastic. Some of them really have a feeling of desolation to them (which i like in particular). You also love shooting buildings, etc and have a nice eye for design, some of your work looks very graphic design to me, which is a style that a lot of people love. One thing i did notice was a lack of close up work. Everyone has a shooting level they are comfortable with and that works for them but it's imp. to all try to shoot in other ways to capture all your bases. I myself just realized that i need to shoot more basic hotel, inn type shots since i don't have anything like that. In your case, i would recommend some tighter, usual vantage point shots so people can see that you can shoot in a varied way.

Other than that, I think if you take a class at a local college that will help point you different directions and teach you how to fine tone your style. You need someone who can see your work in person and point you in different directions.

as for selling your work, it is really your target audience that you want to create your portfolio around. You could see on a place like etsy.com which is a great way to get your name out but it takes a lot of time online promoting. You could also try stock photo shops but again, you get paid for pennies on the dollar there and you have to read the fine print carefully. Really decide who your target is then streamline the portfolio.

you have some great stuff! pm me if you want any more info

sorry i meant to say "unusual vantage point" not usual

Thanks! I appreciate all the feedback.

Markus- thanks for the advice. I know what you`re saying! I actually get pretty harsh critique in my job, so when I started thinking more seriously about my photography, I was prepared for the `heavier```comments. I`d love it if your brother took a look at them.

At this point in my life, I seem to be more open, which is very freeing....

Littlemustard- I really appreciated your feedback. I`ve actually thought of splitting my flickr account, myself. I just hadn`t done it yet. Your feedback was great. It`s nice to hear suggestions on how to improve and change my work.

Something to keep in mind with posting photos online is that they are effectively dead as money makers. I know this is a glass-half-empty sort of approach, but there is nothing you can do to protect your photos once you put them online. Using html tricks to bury it, or embedding it into a flash gallery will keep the average schmuck from stealing it, but a quick screen capture will pull the image off in a heartbeat.


MY theory is that your very best photos should not see the light of flickr. Let's say you go out and shoot a particular mountain scene. If you're really working on becoming a better photographer, you should have played with different angles, apertures, shutter speeds, etc. At the end of the process, you'll have 5 to 50 photos of that once scene. Odds are that it's down to a top 2 or 3 images that you can rank as your best. It's images 2 or 3 that should go up on flickr and the best should be reserved for money making endeavors.

If you're not using those photos for financial gain, then what really is the problem with someone else stealing them? Of course we don't like it for a variety of reasons, but you have to decide when you've reached the point of wanting to protect your intellectual property.

Another way to think of this is with the analogy of a freelance writer. If you're writing an article about Angkor Wat and you want to sell it to Esquire magazine, would you post your article or rough drafts on Bootsnall? No. If you really wanted to share your experience you'd write a piece that doesn't cross over with the Esquire article and post that. If it's feedback you were after (and if you've got Esquire accepting your work, then you're probably more confident than this) then you'd only show your manuscript to a trusted peer review network. Same-same for photography.


Now, back to the original topic... when you say "look into possibly earning a little money on the side," can I ask what you had in mind?

Everything I said above is different if we're just talking about printing photos, gluing them to some nice card stock, and selling them at a few local shops. The above all becomes more relevant as your market becomes wider and more high-profile.

Also, I'm interested because I'm thinking of moving into the freelancing market but not quite in a quit-my-job-and-this-is-my-new-life kind of way. I dunno, it's fuzzy at this point

Yeah, Markus is right. You do have to be careful about that. Some people put watermarks on images at least at that point it would take a lot of work to steal your photos and photoshop then back to normal. I myself really need to research methods. You think, there are photos EVERYWHERE online so there must be some better way to protect your work.

My opinion is that watermarks are best reserved for thumbnails of images you're selling prints of. Outside of that instance, I think they're kind of silly. I guess a small copyright notice in one corner is another story.

On the general topic, there was an interesting article in the NYT about flickr and photo theft back in October:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/01/technology/01link.html?ref=business

quote:

One moment, Alison Chang, a 15-year-old student from Dallas, is cheerfully goofing around at a local church-sponsored car wash, posing with a friend for a photo. Weeks later, that photo is posted online and catches the eye of an ad agency in Australia, and Alison appears on a billboard in Adelaide as part of a Virgin Mobile advertising campaign.

that's a good article. Thanks for sharing! I have to do some more research on the subject for sure. I don't use any of the photo sharing sites but still i plan on putting a gallery on my website. The other thing people have done is put a small thumbnail of a section of the photo close up (so that you can see the grain/dti is excellent quality). Then they put the larger pic in at a lower dti, which no one could print for anything of any use. However, it is inconvenient for people looking but i guess it's an example of something you can do.

If your serious about tryng to make a living posting images online is NOT the way to go. Images online are for family and friends, (especially Flicker)

I have BFA from the art institue in SF, Have worked professional out of Asia and have taught. Now i enjoy photogrpahy,

Had one instructor who told us if u realy love photography NEVER try and make money out of it but get a job at the Post office that pays well .

I agree 100%

IN the end if ur serious u wont make much if anything by posting ur images online. U will need a stock house ot carry your images.

These two sites allow u to post ur images and will arrange sales but......

http://www.zenfolio.com/zf/features.aspx
http://www.imagekind.com/Default.aspx