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I have noticed a crossing point in spiritualism. As soon as you say spiritual, everyone associates with a religion. I myself think religion has noththing to do with spiritualism. My definition of spiritualism is getting to know your self, fixing and changing the things you want to, getting to know your environement, and not haveing to follow some sort of guideline. I guess you can say I have a mechanical mind. I spent many years doing the society thing and am completely bored with the direction it takes you. SO I bagged it all and went hitchhiking. I love the freedom, the outdoors, and the day to day survival. I did find something on my travels, the time to work on myself and inevitabley, I found myself, who I am, what I am, and what I have been doing all these years.
Spirtual=Pertaianing to life and everthing that accompanies that, air, water, food, vision, ect.
What is the purpose of life, live and die?? Or is it the journey inside ourselves that answers that question? I prefer to keep questions like this in my mind. I dont think the color of ones skin has much meaning in the grand ol scheme of life. So I guess what ever road a person takes to fullfill thier journey ( the quest for knowledge of life) is a good thing.
I hope someday this world we live can overcome our barriers, and be able to travel the stars insearch of our home, ourselves, and encounter with other life.....
Hitch
Hitcers Spot on the Web
{url]http://www.hitchhiker.50megs.com[/url]

I completely agree with you on that. I'm about to take off on my own adventures as soon as I can sell my house. I'm looking for an answer, but I don't even really know the question yet. All I know is I won't find either in my present situation. May the wind be at the backs of those of us who seek.

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Regards,

KillAllDash9

It was great to read these messages! I am selling all my stuff and going off to Europe. Not as a tourist, as a human being. I want to live and see the world from different prespectives. Its comforting to know that other have gone before me to do this sort of thing. I am seeking the unnamed. I don't know for sure what I'll find, but prehaps it will just be myself, wich will be a true treasure.

When I get some stuff worth selling, I'll sell it and carry on with my journey.

I think spirituality and religion can co exist although they are different. I think it takes guts to explore and ask hard questions of yourself and your environment. Too many religions seem to suggest they have it figured out and for you not to ask questions, simply read the book and 'believe'. Just following someone else's opinion without exploring the options myself isn't good enough.

Some people will have you believe that if you aren't allied to some major religion or sit in a drumming circle smoking herb all day you aren't spiritual. That's balony.

I think for someone who is religious it must be exciting to travel and ask oneself real questions, then relate them to your religion and see if there's common ground.

One of the people who did this to an incredible degree was Joseph Campbell. He was one of the foremost authorities on comparitive mythologies. He grew up in NYC as a Catholic choirboy and had a fascination with Native American culture. As he explored the mytholgies of different cultures around the World he noticed a pattern, a storyline and a similar dynamic that continued.

http://www.rain.org/~young/articles/campbell.html

Viva the journey!

Nick

Interesting. I was thinking about this quite a bit lately and had some rich discussions about it.

Generally people (and me, myself) do not consider me as a very spiritual person. The reason for this is probably, because I'm very distant from anything that includes faith. Nevertheless, I wouldn't really call myself a strict 'head person'; I do understand to listen into myself and follow what is coming from there.
I have friends though, spiritual people (I'd call them esoteric people), who actually deny me my spirituality. I had a heated argument with a friend last week because of this. She's practicing Ayurveda and Shiatsu (forgive me, if it is spelled wrongly), reads Castañeda, goes to Shamans and Tibetan doctors. Generally she believes, that the whole western society is anti-spiritual (because to distant to nature) and that it is not worth changing this society, but that it has to be abandoned.
Our argument happened this way: We went to the WSIS (Word Summit of the Information Society, organized by the UN). A panel discussion had the topic of how we can deal with the flood and the speed of information, without loosing our spirituality. The thing was, that (although not a religious person) I feel and think pretty much what they were talking about during the discussion. In the end, they did a guided meditaion. I do not dig such things, because I do not have to be told, what I find within myself. I believe, that every individual is different and feels different inside. I simply do not like dogmas. After the session, I talked to my friend and told her, that I did not like the guided meditation for the above mentioned reasons - but that appart from this, I'd feel pretty much the same as they. She got angry then and said, that I'm not spiritual anyway and that I did not like the guided meditation because of this.

To have a conclusion: spirituality to me is, when a person is in touch with its inner self, its true self. I think, I'm a spiritual person, because I can listen to what my real desires are. Desires that eventually make be feel better about myself. And now it comes: I do not believe it to be spiritual, when there is somebody telling you, where to look and what to find.

Am I completely wrong? What is your perception of spirituality?
Adrian

www.aresthetics.ch/trav
My personal travel website

It might take long to read, but I wouldn’t have spend so much time on it if I didn’t think it was worth writing.

If I were to open the subject on Spirituality with the depth it deserves, this notice board would be saturated.
Instead I will bring to surface only a few concise ideas that my mind has provided me through Divine inspiration. (I freely say Divine, because I am determined and convicted that my ideas has no misleading or brainwashing intentions…only that to inform those who are interested in the OTHER reality less considered. If you will, the Bigger Picture.)

Body, Soul, Spirit.

The physical matter that makes up this world and our body is just microscopic compounds of chemicals, salts, minerals, oxygen and other substances physical substances. What makes these substances though?
The smallest particle as we all know, is the electron.
What is the electron? What gives electrons charges, and what makes it vibrate at speeds close to that of light, if not more? Did you know that the ENERGY found vibrating an electron is actually the same consistency of that of spirits?

Then…let us ask….

WHAT IS SPIRIT?

WHAT IS THAT ENERGY?

WHO PUT IT THERE?

WHY IS IT THE SMALLEST PATICLE WITHIN EACH ATOM THE SAME OF THAT AS SPIRIT?

WHY ARE WE ALL IN SEARCH OF OUR TRUE ESSENCE, PURPOSE AND MEANING?

These I will not answer although I have already found them.

Yes, our spirit is within us. Intangible, invisible, even repressed in some, but undoubtedly present. It is what drives those who are in search of themselves (in search of their spirituality) towards Nature, peacefulness, quietness, beauty, and a more “spiritual” (mostly misused term: religious”) lifestyle.

The best way to visualize what I mean for us travelers, is identifying the ORIGIN OF our inborn passion and desire for traveling, exploring, seeing virgin landscapes, feeling the presence of the Power in the Wind, the trees, the water, the rocks….stepping for the first time (or relatively) onto ground that bears us with a sense of humility, pleasure, and excitement. It is then and there that we uncover a part of our hidden spirit, which we ourselves chose to ignore day to day, burying it with the noise and distraction of our TODAYS “world”.

Let us not forget that we came from Spirit, and therefore a good half of us consists of it.
It is what will continue to LIVE AFTER our physical matter has vanished and decomposed. Like our bodies, our spirit and soul must be polished, looked after, and nourished. Feed your mind, (your horse) your spirit (your energy) and your body (your chariot) will no longer require so much superficial care.

I believe that one of the most indulging way of doing this is by traveling, just like all of you in Bootsnall…. It is what drives us so mad about traveling…. Its not for the parties (although there can be some pretty wild and fun ones), its not for the Guys and the Chicks (although we tend to meet the most interesting, unique people whilst on journeys)… it is for the SPIRITUAL SATISFACTION AND NOURISHMENT provided when we see the Perfection of Mother Nature and the Grandness of He/She who Created it.

It is the visible answer to our question, it is the treasure we all search for. The mythical paradise we know exists.

Thank you and In La’Kech.
Natalie Eidi

Natalie Eidi Compean

Wow, ok, I'm NOT spiritual!

natalieeidi, could you please give me a source for this:
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What gives electrons charges, and what makes it vibrate at speeds close to that of light, if not more? Did you know that the ENERGY found vibrating an electron is actually the same consistency of that of spirits?
---

Adrian

www.aresthetics.ch/trav
My personal travel website

Natalieeidi - Cool post! I have similar beliefs and it's cool to hear someone write them down. Peace.

Sincerely,
the TP necklace guy!

Right on! Right on!

I love to see posts like this! It lets me know that there still is true seekers out there.


I've come to the conclusion, that true seekers are the exception, rather than the rule.

So...when you find another soul, willing to discuss such matters with you...know that is time well spent.

Keep asking the big questions, and the answer will follow.

"Seek and ye shall find"!

One tip...do keep a journal to record your revelations or the truth, as it appears to you. Never erase...only add to it...for it shall soon become a log of your personal and spiritual growth...toward your full self actualization.

I'm still waiting for a source backing up the 'electrons have the same energy driving them than spirits' thesis.
Additionally, as much as I understand of physics, the quark is smaller than the electron, isn't it?
Adrian

www.aresthetics.ch/trav
My personal travel website

Hi everyone, i hope you dont find things too hectic and rushed this time of the year in gregorian calander.

Moderator : THank you for your wonderful advice in keeping a journal. I fully belevie in the importance of one for those who like to think and allow their minds to wander full blast


the source on electrons is from a ROSICRUCIAN lesson, i am unable to find it on the net, which would have been easier for me to copy and paste, but it seems that the correspondance between student and teacher in the 70s and 80s are not updated into the web, so i have the pamphlets at home.
My father has all the lessons, 12 degrees with 4 categories of difficulties, about 15 lessons each, so, i cant really copy them on text, but i suggest whoever is interested in the more mystical approach to life, should browse and read some of the ROSICRUCIAN TEACHINGS.
http://www.rosicrucian.com/
i dont recommend you dwell there just soak up as much infor as your mind permits and ponder on it for New yEars and then, when sufficient time has passed for your mind to have developed different ideas, post them beacause id be really interested to read them.

Anyway, another interesting fact about spiritualism.... for there are other spirits than that of the Divine.

"And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world"
1 John 4:3
Source: Holy Bible King James Version

I do not wish to raise controversy on religious beleifs or topics, but this source is the oldest, most purely conserved book since the age of man has begun to write (king James version…do not be mistaken!!!) and scientifically proven to be written and encoded by a Divine Author …. Just another note to make you guys think and have a nice Christmas….



hey Old hippy..... cool picture. id like to update mine, but am unable. Anyway ill check the posts again to see if anyone answered.
Kisses from me!!!

Natalie Eidi Compean

Hm, I don't want to be a fun spoiler or a wise ass here, I'm critic but interested. So please, do not take offence, if I'm questioning some of your believes. I'm just one curious bastard...

1. I always have intellectual problems with thesis' that are several decades, even centuries old. How should I take a thesis for real, if it is not uptodate on scientific research. Like the example of the electron. How should I believe in the 'energy that makes the electron (as the smallest item) vibrate', when we know these days, that the electron is not the smallest possible item? Hm...

2. I strongly disagree with a statement 'this source is the oldest, most purely conserved book since the age of man'. The Bible, any version of the Bible, has continuesly been adapted in order to serve the ruling power. Mostly it was done by the Vatican - but other religious tendencies/groupings did excactely the same.
Don't get me wrong (and if you're faithful, don't be offended), I value the Bible as a philosophically and morally highly valuable book! It just should not be dogmatized.

Hm...I guess this criticism is the reason why my 'spiritual' friends believe me to have no connection to my inner self. I just don't swallow everything the way it's served...

Adrian

www.aresthetics.ch/trav
My personal travel website

Posted by elAdi -

quote:

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Hm...I guess this criticism is the reason why my 'spiritual' friends believe me to have no connection to my inner self. I just don't swallow everything the way it's served...

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I think that's great, you should question these things(with an open mind). That's how the truth is found. Question these theories, search for truth with an open mind honestly for yourself and search without any preconceived notions. Always search for truth and you'll be ok!

Sincerely,
the TP necklace guy!

Tnx, Bear!

www.aresthetics.ch/trav
My personal travel website

Adrian aka. eladi...

I have answered a post elsewhere you had directed to me...so I do hope you follow your wake and retrieve your replies...

When you questioned the science associated with the spiritial-atomic structure comment above,I was there for you pal...for no way, no how will science come to belive in the spiritual nature of life.

For, every physicist I have known, their philosophies are limited to comments like..."If you can't measure it...it does not exist"

and..."Everything is part of the natural workings of the universe"...there for, even if we don't know something, it does not put it beyond the natural order of the universe.

Meaning that: everything we know is the natural universe...and therefor there is nothing 'super natural' about it... meaning: nothing above it or beyond it.

Or taking it it to the furthist degree of understanding: Everything in life is already supernatural...therefor there is nothing that is above it or beyond it!

So...How can I being a guy who sees that: the mind...body... spirit connection, is the base structure of our being... also agree that the physicists are also right in their way of seeing it?

Simply put..."the limited" and "the unlimited" live side by side...and while in this life, [i.e. the limited state of our being], we are more prone to gravitate to the "limited way of thinking".

This is not a value judgement...this is just part of our human nature. call it "our default" way of thinking.

Kind of like..."When in Rome...live like the Romans"

We enter this state like babes in the woods...totally vulnerable...our thinking and mental image of things are based and shaped on our personal, yet limited experiences, and environment.

Simply put...We go from what we know.

To achieve a higher awareness of our state of being, is sort of like: when a snake sheds its skin...it totally leaves behind its limiting exterior and most importantly its physical protection..and "makes itself totally vulnerable" once again...so that it can continue growing.

Spiritual growth can be measured...just as the rattles on a snake tell you how many times that snake cast off its skin.

identify your limiting behaviors...and cast them off...make yourself vulnerable...instead of insisting you are always so stong...this is the way to spiritual growth and awareness.

...and by the way...some new age practices and the term "spiritual" in my book are too different things entirely...if a discipline does not seem like "the right path for you"...don't take it...find your own path...but don't put down those that think different than you do in the process.

Everyone has the right to find their own path.

What do you think we are doing here any way????

natalieeidi

Thank you for your nice comments..they are, as well as you are, very appreciated here!

Although you took a real stretch on equating energy frequencies wit the existance of the spiritual...I was there for you all the way!

Your insights into energy being the nature of the universe reminded me of something I once learned years ago...

The definition of energy [part 1 only]:

"Energy is the only thing we know of, that can neither be created or destroyed...it can only be changed in its nature".

When I first heard that, I immediately thought...Wow!...It always was...always is...always will be....?????

Why...That sounds like God to me!

[God = that which always has been...is ...and always will be...or, That with no beginning and no end, and at the same time...the source and substance of all being.]

So.... as we are part of that same energy and structure, that makes up the energy, that is our universe...I felt a kinship with your statements...no matter how far out they may seem to any other!


Do more research on it, however...for to equate it the way you did...will always garner inquiring comments about the validity of such a bold statement.

Prove it..they will roar! For it is only natural that they do.

Here is a thought of mine on it, I want to share with you:

Energy is the stuff, our universe is made of. The stuff we can measure we call matter...and the space between it is... that which binds it all together...and goes on virtually for ever.

Yet...They are both part of the same source...being...nature... and creator.

We are only limited, by our limited beliefs...if all we see is the limited matter...and not the stuff, that binds it all together!

Well said, old hippy!

Thanks for the nice words Dusty! How are things in your part of the universe?

...or, whats new dustyshoes?

You're the man old hippy! You're beliefs are right in line with my mothers, I've got to tell her to log on. You're good at writing your thoughts(beliefs) down(so is my mother) and I have a hard time with that, so it's cool to read your threads. Peace.

Sincerely,
the TP necklace guy!

Bear, I'm very impressed you can discuss such things with your Mom! Right on Right on!

Thanks for your kind words.

In fact...I'd like to hear from all the boots spiritual community on how they see the universe...and our place in it?

A good sense of feeling "grounded" with the energy that is...is an important step to finding our own personal peace of mind.

Are the energies currently playing tug of war with you...or are you going with the flow?

Lets hear from you all!